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First attempt at tavern music

Discussion in 'Critique & Feedback' started by Duncan Formosa, Feb 22, 2023.

  1. I got a challenge at work to try and write some tavern like music for a bit of fun. This is what I came up with.

    I think after a bit more practice I'll come back to this one at some point and extend it a bit, change up the instruments once I get a bit more comfortable with what instruments are used for this kind of music and how. Think the recorder all the way through might be a bit grating even for a short piece like this (either that or I've heard it too much.) Still, I think it was an interesting test and could be worse for 5 hours work.


     
  2. Hell yeah, I like it.

    I didn't find the recorder grating, but I like recorder.
     
    Duncan Formosa likes this.
  3. #3 Mike Verta, Mar 2, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2023
    Vibe is good. Couple of the chords are out of period, depending on the period. :) Good exercise; you can't do enough of these!
     
  4. Good job! As soon as I get my damned studio finished I'd like to do more challenges like this. I didn't find the recorder grating, especially since this type of folky (Irish?) music tends to be performed by small ensembles with a large focus on monophonic melody.
     
  5. Re: out of period chords. I think if this was written for some cheesy, kevin costner, robin hood: prince of theives, 'period' film then the occasional modern sounding chord changes would be totally fine and would fit the idiom.
     
    Duncan Formosa likes this.
  6. hey Duncan, the track is cool!
    The composition itself is fine, no out of period chords imo.
    I hear something not flowing well with the rythm pattern chosen for comping section: sounds a bit too "smart". The flute sound has some articulations at the beginning of the phrase that throughs the timing out a bit.
    other than this it is cool. You might consider changing a bit the pallet for the B section to add dimension.
    Cheeers
    nico
     
    Daniele Nasuti likes this.
  7. #7 Daniele Nasuti, Mar 16, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2023
    Really loved that chord at 0.30 and 0.46 !! At that time after what you did before, that chord there is so pleasant...

    @Tom Welsh I undarstand why you think about Robin Hood(Michael Kamen) but hearing this "tavern" track I feel more it's for a videogame, kind of medieval and "tavern" as the title.
    Robin Hood to me it's a different sound big orchestra, big film melody and orchestration.
    Instead this track here I think it's just what was written for.

    As @Nico Bellisario said I feel something a bit out of time too but only in the flute melody, not in the percussions. Maybe I feel that because since I had that timing problems too (for many reasons, included my personal mistakes playing) now I've probably becomed too much sensitive to that.
    Anyway these are all musician's and composer's considerations, because I don't know if a normal person could heare some "mistakes" in your track.

    An advice for everyone: always let some other people listening your music, like someone trusted in your family who is not a musicians but always gives you right advices. Not everyone but only those few people or even one only. Morricone too always asked his wife Maria to listen his music before deliver(as he said in the recent documentary by Tornatore), and she was not musician but always understand something special and was able to give the right advice, if needed.
     
  8. I think it does sound a little out of time in places. I've noticed that there are a lot of libraries that even when they are quantised perfectly they still go out of time which is super annoying. I'd rather not quantise at all but not doing it can be more problematic at times. I can't be bothered going through each note and trying to shift everything because the VST has it's own built in delays, I shouldn't have to do that full stop. No idea why libraries are still done like that.

    I agree. My go to person is my dad, he always gives me honest feedback and normally he can pinpoint where the problems are and he's done that since I was very very young. I think a lot of people think he's a little harsh but I find it to be very valuable, I would never get as far as I have without his feedback. It's also very satisfying when he listens to a new track and doesn't say anything cause it means he really likes it!
     
    Daniele Nasuti likes this.
  9. sure, we are composers, not performers, we should only write notes on paper (or directly in the DAW piano roll or sheet music software). Think if Ennio Morricone or John Williams had to do all this mess with quantising and so... I think they would have lost so much time and couldn't concentrate their efforts on what really counts: composition, orchestration and personal music taste.

    As I said on my last piece "Crazy people adventure" I had so many prolems with quantising and adjust single notes that even if I wrote that piece in few hours I spent an entire week adjusting it... I didn't know about negative delay and so my tracks even recorded with click were all different from click (even if quantised), and between them, so I had to adjust not only single notes that were out of time but also each track with the others..
    Instead of losing all that time I could have done better mixing or sounds, or write much more pieces.
    So now I learned to do things differently.

    Now I prefer semi-quantise(or quantise only parts that have problems). Or even better quantise 100% or some less, but with the right negative delay already set on each track.
    (I discovered that each library vst has a different negative delay, and each articulations even on the same library has a different negative delay). With that set will be all more even and we can focus only on music.
    There is a post on VIControl with all the negative delays for each vst library so you don't have to mess with it yourself.

    I know that quantising is a bit less natural sounding but if it's at least decent and good I prefer that than wasting many days for adjusting it.
    Lot of working composers do that, and the mockups are quite good.
     
    Duncan Formosa likes this.
  10. I found that with my orchestral stuff I've managed to find a good balance. I mainly use more playable libraries as much as I can like the Infinite Series stuff and I hardly ever need to quantise that. Strings on the other hand I will need to quantise especially if they are holding the rhythm section. So I try to record the rhythm first, quantise it and that will replace the metronome for me. Then I just record the playable libraries on top of that without quantising it. That seems to work for me most of the time now. Here I was using a library I've never used before so there was a lot of learning of how the VST handles.

    That's one of my biggest gripes with libraries, there's very few of them that will let you have a free trial to see if it works for you personally. All the audio demos just play to the libraries strengths, they never show what it can't do and the walkthroughs give you an idea on the sound of the patches but only in a certain context. And you can never feel "well this library has built in delays so that even if it's quantised it's still a little out of time" etc.

    I can't believe libraries are STILL being made like this. Surely we should have advanced by now? I mean there are people out there making more playable libraries which is great but it baffels me that companies like Spitfire and Orchestral tools are still producing the same stuff over and over again. "Oh look, now your orchestra will sound like it was recorded in Abbey Road" I mean...kinda I guess but the music you can make on it is still a bit meh.
     

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