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Some doubts about the way

Discussion in 'Tips, Tricks & Talk' started by Manuel Cervera, May 13, 2019.

  1. Excuse me, but I'm full of doubts. I want to compose, go from being a hobby to my profession. As soon as possible. And I do not mean by this that I want to take shortcuts. But I feel a little overwhelmed by the amount of work to be able to do it: I have to learn to play the piano. I have to transcribe daily. I have to listen to music. I have to learn to make good mixes and mastering. I have to get time to train (especially Mike's masterclass) I have to compose ..... This are my questions: How do you organize to be able to advance with everything? I am clear that I have to compose good works to generate interest. There are intermediate steps (niches) to be able to generate income no matter how small? Excuse my doubts (and my English).
     
  2. I hope someone else can give you more optimistic advice, but my impression based on talking to numerous folks in the industry are that if your goals are to "work in music" rather than "work and make music", especially "as soon as possible", learning the craft of traditional composition isn't the necessary route. I also think getting into this industry to make money as fast as possible is going to lead to disappointment. I know the dream is always to make "the hobby" into "the career", but this isn't always as great as it may seem.

    Composition is a lifelong journey, and it used to be the case that the greats got the work. Not so anymore. Mike writes at a caliber far higher than the majority of Hollywood composers I can come up with off the top of my head, but he's not doing blockbusters, nor working primarily in composition (as far as I understand). There are ways to get into the industry (I can't really help you there), but they are not necessarily linked to what Mike teaches (namely craft). It seems more important to have good production skills than composition chops in a lot of cases. The skilled people still get the work, but it's not always the people who are skilled at composing.

    There also seems to be a common idea in composition these days that being a musician at all is somehow equal to or secondary to getting work, which I don't really understand. If the study, work and ultimately the process isn't something that appeals to you primarily, you may be in the wrong craft. Would you continue to do music even if you knew you could never make money doing it? I've never thought of listening to music as something I "have" to do, as if it's a necessary and undesirable means to an end. Please correct me if I misunderstand.

    Industry aside, from the perspective of organizing to get better, the best advice I've gotten is to think top-down vs bottom-up. Large, complex tasks, rather than separating everything. I.e. Transcribe a few bars of music, write a variation on the melody and write a new harmony and change the rhythm. Practice it on piano until it's playable. Then take that short section, post a piano reduction on this forum, then orchestrate it and play it into your DAW with virtual instruments, then post that. Do all this for a few days and you've just covered orchestration, transcription, instrument practice, theory (intuitively), composition broadly, and mixing (and probably got some fantastic feedback) all in one long, connected/focused task.
     
  3. It no longer requires musical skill to be a professional composer. If this is your goal, buy a few loops libraries and epic sound sets and learn the handful of patterns which now literally comprise everything from Avengers blockbusters to Game of Thrones episodes. Instead, focus your energy on becoming friends with people who produce these things. I don't mean solicit them with your work, I mean find ways to inject yourself into their social circles. If you are not clever enough to figure this out, you won't succeed anyway, since 9/10ths of working professionally is about relationships, not ability.

    Ability is why they'll remember you or not; has nothing to do with paying your bills. No shortage of brilliant artists, whose works we celebrate today, died broke and anonymous. Being great, and possibly remembered is an entirely different goal - takes a lifetime.

    Working takes a pulse, a little psychology, and a good personality.

    _Mike
     
  4. Sadly that's super true in my experience (not with music, but in general).


    By the way Mike, I recommended your business masterclass to a 3D artist who is looking to break into the games industry and he said he liked it and already recommended it to other artists he knows. The things you teach are just so universal!
     
  5. My current path is teaching guitar (I get paid to transcribe and I happen to like teaching) and doing composition on the side. I think you have to be willing to have multiple sources of income or have combined interests like teaching and music in order to really make it practical.
     
    Martin Hoffmann likes this.
  6. When you talk about production, do you mean mix and master?

    It's what I've been doing so far. Of course I would. But I prefer that you come with money.

    I think like you. I wanted to signify that at the end of the day there are a number of hours that we can devote to doing things. I enjoy the process of transcribing, I love learning. I like to learn piano. Everything I need, I like, but you have to dedicate a time and sometimes it seems huge.


    I love your response.
     
  7. Are you talking about about Cinema or Music industry in general?
    Is it the same for TV? Games?
    Are you talking about success (great success) or work?
     
  8. It's the same everywhere. Game music is occasionally better, but it's graded on a curve. As with everything else, there are occasional, statistically irrelevant exceptions whose contributions are obliterated by sheer number of oppositional data points.

    But this academic. You said you wanted to make money with your music, soon, and my advice is to spend zero energy on the music. The alternative; my personal path; the one I'm teaching my son; is to be a master of your craft; to do everything to the limit of your ability; to be an interesting person, and reap ultimately greater - if less predictable - rewards. Ain't nothin' soon about that path. Soon is 140-character thoughts; YouTube content jumpcut for 5-second attention spans; meme platitudes; "insta-stories." Soon is also when these things will be forgotten.

    It is possible to pursue multiple goals simultaneously, I suppose, but you have to be real about the processes and your priorities. It would be cruel, unusual, and dishonest of me to advise a young composer that the path to financial success was tied to his mastery of craft. That would be a contemptible lie. Actresses weren't blowbanging Harvey Weinstein and co. by the hotel-suite-load because they expected to be rewarded justly for their talent, and neither should you.
     
  9. Anyway, I think it's good to trust your own instincts. And my instinct tells me that the path you propose, Mike, is the one that moves me the most.
    Among other things, because it means going a bit against the current.
    Everyone is crazy with epic music.
    I want to do something different from that.

    I love music.
    I love to create music.
    And I want music as a way to pay the bills.
    If there are people doing this, I can.
    And I am sure, that, the advice you give to your son, is good for me as well.
    Thank you very much, Mike.
     
    1. Transcribe a few bars
    2. Write a variation on the melody
    3. Write a new harmony
    4. Change the rhythm
    5. Practice it on piano (original and yours)
    6. Orchestrate it
    7. Post a piano reduction for feedback
    8. Re-orchestrate
    9. Play it into your DAW
    10. Post that for feedback

    Easy. I needed your advice, guys.
    Thank you very much.
    I´m on the way.
     
    Rohann van Rensburg likes this.
  10. Glad to hear it, that's what this forum is for. The story of fame and material reward over personal and artistic integrity is not an unfamiliar one, and it's always heartening to see people choose the latter.

    Don't take my advice list as a template set in stone, by the way -- it's simply an example of incorporating skills into a cohesive task. Just think broadly of applying transcription to a new piece of music, and making it more your own. Williams stole from the greats, Mozart and Bartok stole from folk melodies, etc. Doug showed me an example once of combining a melodic idea from Harry Potter with Stravinsky's Firebird as an exercise -- it's a great way to intuitively see how things fit together and apply transcription creatively. If I'm dry on creative ideas, it means I need to listen to and transcribe a lot more.
     
    Manuel Cervera likes this.
  11. #12 Manuel Cervera, May 14, 2019
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
    I was blocked with the amount of work. Then, I was doing nothing.
    I know that the idea is: TRANSCRIBE.
    But I saw:
    * 1,5 hrs to learn piano (sometimes boring exercises)
    * 2 hrs Transcribe
    * 2 h courses or tutorials (Comp. and production)
    * 2 h composing
    All these four parts not very linked.
    I have no time for that. At least at the moment.

    With the list, all of them are linked.
    And more funny.
    Really helpful at the point I am.

    Could you explain the exercise?
    Is there any post?
     
  12. Glad to hear that! I was very much in the same boat. Curse the educational curriculum that taught me in a segmented manner for 13 years. And yes, in doing nothing lies the danger. Every day counts when you're on a lifelong journey.



    Basically what I mentioned, really. Transcribe an idea and gradually turn it into your own through melodic variation, new harmony, changes in rhythm, etc, and if you're out of ideas, combine it with another piece you transcribed. Keep adding and changing elements until it becomes your own, but start at the foundation of the idea (i.e. two handed piano and chords).
    A fantastic exercise is taking an existing melody and trying out all the chord progression variations you can underneath. It's amazing how much variation can introduce, but it simultaneously also shows you that there is a distinct harmonic hierarchy in terms of "conclusiveness", "satisfaction", etc. Some progressions will sound really interesting and tense, and reliable old progressions will sound satisfying in a way no other progression will.
     
    Manuel Cervera likes this.
  13. Today I was enjoying Mike variations of Twinkle Twinkle. On the "Mod Squad" masterclass.
    What I would do if I was able to do that....

    I´ll try it in a while
     

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