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The Doors of My Mind

Discussion in 'Critique & Feedback' started by Aaron Venture, Dec 12, 2017.

  1. #1 Aaron Venture, Dec 12, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017
    Here's a new piece of mine. Or rather, a piece I started two months ago and just finished recently. The aim here was to do a sweep across the entire palette and dynamic range, as well as having a simple form and a simple rhythmic motif while keeping it interesting.



    I hope it doesn't take as long next time. What I've learned during this period is that limitations are awesome, especially when I tried them and wrote A Sea of Stars in 2 days. For this piece, I started with a blank page and the first thing I came up was the rhythmic motif. I wrote it on a piano and then it was more or less: "Huh, where the fuck do I go now?". I think I'm gonna stick to the limitations approach until I build a vocabulary big enough that it all becomes one and the same.

    Any commentary and advice would be very much welcome.

    EDIT: Lossless here
     
  2. Neat ! Nice piece. For some reason it made me think of the ocean :)

    I mean this in the best way - it would work best to images. It has a great expansive and "time moving" quality to it.

    Really my only comments are not on this piece. It's more that if you intend to further explore this road, I have a suggestion for the next piece you write.

    That is keep the same "limitations approach" this is already working very well for you, and that you seem to enjoy the results of.
    However play a little more with the listeners expectations, and what is perceivable and what is not. Some times (IMO) you want things not perceivable.
    Like a magic trick.... it's not really magic if everyone sees how you do it.

    This is directly related to how a composer uses repetition. The mind has a very hard time distinguishing between literal repetitions and similar.
    Also the mind will look for a pattern and aim to predict a knowable outcome. This is what you can play with as a story-teller.

    For example, ever heard the lullaby "Mary Had a Little Lamb?"

    In theory, because everyone is so familiar with this; by the time the words "Mary Had" are sung the listener will begin filling in the rest.
    But in truth they don't really know what coming up, other than you have planted that expectation

    I could go "Mary Had a little........ chainsaw, and then she went batshit cray and killed 6 people"

    A surprise ending I am sure. More music based, I had to write this piece which uses a very similar approach to yours. It's also in a very conventional style.



    Start at 2:20 and listen to the end. It is all the same phrase repeating in different ways so it hopefully does not feel like the same thing repeating.

    As far as a masterwork to review, and it's sometimes still used in film scores is Beethoven 7th second movement.
    He passes around the same idea but the piece certainly feels moving forward:



    Keep up the great work !!
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  3. Thanks, Doug!

    Solid advice. I do in fact have an idea for it. Will probably start tomorrow.

    What a master that guy was. And Petrucci has the score, of course.

    I will try!

    It's been a while since I got a good wigging. This feels like a proper "trainwrecky" piece Mike could go to town on, so I might send this to Unleashed :D. Although maybe it's a bit too long.
     
    Paul T McGraw likes this.
  4. Send it in !! Of course you should !
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  5. Just wanted to chime in quickly, I definitely enjoyed the piece Aaron! Great work and also a useful reminder regarding limitations.
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  6. My first thought listening to your piece is that the sound is excellent. The samples and your mix are fantastic.

    You definitely have very credible orchestral gestures. What are your composition goals? Do you want to write for money, for films and commercials? If so, I believe I could readily imagine this in media. Are your goals self-expression or to write concert music? The piece would probably need stronger motivic/melodic content as a concert piece since you are writing in a very traditional diatonic style. I'm just referring to audience expectations. You have a great ear, you should not feel any apprehension regarding this track. It is very good.
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  7. Thanks!

    Hah, this is your first post. We don't bite :D
    Wow, thank you for all the kind words!

    More than anything I'd like to make a living out of music. I know that specializing only in one branch is a huge long shot so I'm trying to become prominent in all of them; a one stop shop, if you will. I'd love to write for media. I've done smaller gigs (like radio jingles, short loopey underscores for podcasts) and these were a lot of fun. I'm probably gonna try and get some media gigs soon (gotta get a website up).

    As for writing for concert, I'd love to say that I'm able to do that as well one day :D
     
  8. It is really a good amount of work you put here inside your track. I like it a lot. It has a very good flow. What I like also that keep the motion intact. I need some more walkthroughs to really give some thought regarding what can be improved. Actually I just enjoyed it like it is in this version.
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  9. #9 Louis Calabrese, Dec 14, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017
    It's really pretty Aaron, I like it a lot. Although I enjoy the composition I'm the most impressed in your use of samples, mix, and orchestral balance.
     
    Paul T McGraw and Aaron Venture like this.
  10. I'd love to have some incite into its creation. I could add a list of questions, but since you were aiming for a piece that demonstrated the full dynamic range of your palette, I'd like to know more about your choices there (orchestration, composition, structure, etc). It would be very helpful indeed!
     
  11. I initially wrote the rhythmic motif. Then I wrote the melody. I was then just playing around with the melody, coming up with different harmonizations and versions. I wrote the finale version (just chords and melody). Then I wrote everything in between. I aimed for this piece to be around 4 minutes, and to have at least one pass of the B side, so that's how I decided on the structure. I think it's important to have an idea of what your structure should be, if not at least a blurry picture of it. Fully planning it out from the start could be ungrateful, though, as I never know where composition will take me. I usually write a melody, play around with it, write different variations, then think about what do I want to do with the piece, and decide my rough structure based on that. I can often imagine how it ends and once the finish line is in sight, it's not as scary anymore.

    Here's the piano version. This is the final version of that sketch. Beside harmony not being complete throughout the piece, It's missing the buildup/bridge and the finale lacks all the arpeggios and counterpoint. I have a hard time really expressing myself on a piano in a way that comes across clear to someone else. I'm sure you can hear everything I meant now that you've heard the mockup first; the other way around would've been a completely different story.

    However, as I was writing it, the whole final sound was already clear in my head, I just had to go through orchestration to figure out exactly what it all was. So practicing orchestration on all fronts was another reason to go through the entire palette.

    I knew I was starting with solo piano which would then get colored with mallets and/or harp. I changed mallets dynamics/overall color every 8 or 16 bars. I also knew that the first melody statement was in strings. Initially just first chairs, then the sections behind them became louder for every part of the melody, and horns coming in for the fourth part.

    For the tingly upper runs it was obvious what it was, there was no question about that.

    So now we've heard strings, a short horn line, running woodwinds with low string pizz - what's gonna take our next melody pass? What with the range I played it in, brass was an easy and obvious choice here. Also during composition I felt I could start twisting the melody just slightly here. Then came the B side and I knew I wanted to go to forte here at the point between A and B. I just followed the ranges. I kept changing the focus between instruments/sections here a lot, as I wrote this part in a call and response way. I also paid a lot of attention to rhythm dynamics, keeping the rhythm present and clear all the time, while still changing the rhythm colors along with the melody.

    The bridge/buildup was what I did at the very end. I kept making it more complicated than it had to be. I did a few versions, none of which ultimately worked. Then I just did the most simple thing I could imagine and I liked it. The finale is just your FF finale. Hits every 4 bars, low instruments keeping the backbone of rhythm, opposite arpeggios for cellos and bassoons, taikos along the counterlines. Horns, violins, flutes and then trumpets playing the melody, everything else doing either harmony or counterpoint (violas doing both).
     
  12. Nice. I really like the vibe of the piece, and there's some good ideas in there. My main comment, just from listening through the first time, and also a second time, is that I was really struggling to identify what your main idea/melody was throughout the piece. I kept waiting for something that I recognized to come back... Personally, I couldn't quite figure it out. That was a little frustrating - But that might just be me. Nice work nonetheless!
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  13. Hey Aaron,

    I'm writing this on my second listen of your piece. I think you have a great opening sequence, and the production sounds clean and warm. With the cello melody coming in ~0:50, I really miss the wind melody from the beginning, I feel that could be explored and developed more, maybe using the strings melody as an eventual counter melody. :-? Great build, great dynamic development. Love the harmony at 2:30. Without much of a unifying melody throughout, some of the hits/feel changes seem a bit aggressive and superfluous. I feel like this piece could benefit immensely from a similar motif peppered or tied throughout.
     
    Aaron Venture likes this.
  14. I agree with every one of your points, especially now that it's been some time since I wrote and produced this piece. I wrote in previous replies that I purposely bit off more than I could chew with this piece in order to see where will I end up. But yeah, overall it's a flawed piece.

    I don't know where would I begin with the reparations (probably because it's still more than I can chew) and I feel like it's just easier to go and write a new piece, applying all that I've learned here and being careful not to fall into the traps I've fallen here.

    Thanks for the listen and commentary!
     

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